Why Christians need to be able to spot manipulation in the opposite sex.

Women have one of the great acts of all time. The smart ones act very feminine and needy, but inside they are real killers. The person who came up with the expression ‘the weaker sex’ was either very naive or had to be kidding. I have seen women manipulate men with just a twitch of their eye — or perhaps another body part.

  • Donald Trump, in The Art of the Comeback

Ha!  I think we may have found our answer to my previously asked question: Why did the boys like dizzy girls and not smart girls?

Actually, I don’t agree that all smart women decide to act feminine and needy to get what they want from men, but he is correct that this behavior is part of the possible feminine repertoire, even if some women choose never to use it.

But why do some women choose to use it?  Is it because they are “killers”?  I don’t know, but I suspect they are probably using it because they have found that this behavior works.  It gets them what they want because some (many? most?) men like it and respond to it.

This is the same reason why I have very little sympathy for the feminists who are flipping out about the pick-up artist lecturer Roosh V coming to Canada; “game” is a male behavior some men use for getting what they want.  If feminists don’t want men to act like pick up artists, then instead of mouthing some “sex positive” bull pucky about how empowering casual hook-ups are, they ought to encourage women not to respond to this kind of behavior by giving men who use it what they want.  Similarly, if men don’t like women putting on a feminine and needy act to get what they want, they shouldn’t be so quick to respond to such women by giving them what they want.  If you don’t like some particular behavior, don’t respond to it and teach your children to spot and avoid it as well.

Why do Christians need to learn how to spot and avoid these behaviors?  Shouldn’t they just “know better”?  The reason I think we need to teach this is because men were designed to desire sweet, submissive women who will be good helpers (“I will make a helper suitable for him”); putting on a needy act simulates being a sweet, submissive helper.  Similarly, women were designed to desire a strong, dominant man who can take care of his family; using “game” simulates that.  If we don’t teach our young people to recognize when someone is really making a genuine effort to be a sweet, submissive woman who would make a good helper or a strong man who desires and is able to lead a family, they will be more likely to be tricked by women who are acting needy to acquire resources from a man or men who are using game to acquire casual sex from a woman.

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20 thoughts on “Why Christians need to be able to spot manipulation in the opposite sex.

  1. Of course, some women enjoy being gamed so much that they don’t mind that they are being manipulated. Similarly, some men enjoy the feminine, needy act so much that they don’t mind that they are being manipulated. However, if you enjoy this, then there really is no need to complain about the opposite sex for employing these behaviors. People tend to do whatever gets them what they want.

    Christians, of course, should have other concerns.

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    • A part of the problem is that too many people (definitely among the men, likely among the women) are actually so naive that they fall for the manipulation without realizing that they are being manipulated. For a man to get even a decent understanding of how women tick, the methods they use, what expectations they have, …, he either needs to gain a lot of own experience or learn from others—it is most certainly not something that comes naturally. From what I have gathered from women regarding men, their problem is possibly not as large, but it definitely exists.

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  2. Hmm, interesting.

    “I don’t agree that all smart women decide to act feminine and needy to get what they want from men..”

    I think women do, we all do. That is a very natural and normal way of being in the world. There’s a big difference between acting feminine and needy in order to secure and enjoy a pleasant and mutually satisfying conversation with a man, or manipulating one so he will change the oil on your car. Or pay your rent for you. The fine art of femininity is being lost in the world, but those feminine wiles used to have some morality attached to them, some values, at least a far as ladies were concerned. They were applied with the benefit of men in mind, their pleasure was taken into account.

    That is the same objection I have to the gamers. There is nothing wrong with acting like a man, with learning the fine art of seduction. There is a problem with doing it out of a sense of revenge, to exploit, manipulate, and control because you resent all of womankind. That is a very hostile and adversarial attitude, one that is not good for the men involved, either.

    Surprise! Roosh hates me too, but I’m actually rather supportive of him, I think those fems trying to protest him were hypocrites extraordinaire, and I really hope he finds a good wife and settles down some day 😉

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  3. I am mildly embarrassed at the fuss going on in Canada. Roosh set out to stir up trouble, and he’s found it – plus massive publicity. So he’s got exactly what he wanted. If he had been left alone, he could have done his big talk, and then gone to the pub with the ten people who bothered to show up.

    Re: games people play. Playing at particular romantic roles – which is a game in itself – is part of the fun of new love. But there’s a difference between that and manipulation. Manipulative people of either sex tend to be damaged.

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    • Right, there can be some fun flirtation between a young couple, which I don’t see as a problem. And there is also really trying to be a feminine woman or masculine man because that is the right thing to do. But then there is faking being something you aren’t with the intention of deceiving someone. The Donald Trump quote seems geared at that idea, of a woman who isn’t really sweet, feminine, and needy but who just puts on an act in order to manipulate. I think it’s the same with a lot of the PUA crowd, too; it’s an act meant to deceive and manipulate.

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  4. I’ll stand by my observation made in the “dizzy” post. Boys genuinely like helping girls. It never gets us anywhere but, it’s generousity. As for game, I think that it increases confidence. Aside from that, it’s weak sauce or marginal.

    Now, about Roosh, I have never seen anyone do as much to provoke the local contingent of feminists. He has a talk tonight in Montreal. Next Saturday, he’s in Toronto.

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    • I am not going to link the video from Roosh’s youtube channel but, it seems that he was able to give his talk without incident. I was worried, some of his opponents are more than a little goofy.

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    • I’m not so sure it’s simple, Kate, but I can never quite put it into words properly. Just looking at the root of the word “seduce,” it really just means to captivate, charm, and entice, until you trace it back far enough where it means treason and treachery 😉

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      • I know there’s been a bit of debate at DF’s about the word “seduce”. I think that word does have some yucky connotations and so in order to keep things clear, we could just say that many husbands appreciate it when their wives try to be charming, captivating, sweet, and flirty with them sometimes. Then we can avoid using a loaded word like “seduction” that seems to cause some misunderstanding.

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  5. It strikes me, having read some of the things that “gamers” write and do as video, that a clear hallmark of “excessive game” is how a person will quickly move to areas of interaction that….would generally be considered inappropriate. Here’s an example from recently resigned U-Minnesota athletic director Norwood Teague.

    http://www.startribune.com/star-tribune-s-rayno-adds-her-own-story-to-teague-scandal/321199871/

    Seems to me that as Christians become ever more like the world, what we’re seeing is more and more examples of where the girl just kinda falls into the guy’s bed…..and so we start thinking that sort of thing is normal, and not the development of a relationship going into marriage. My kids actually dislike John Wayne because that’s the motif often used there.

    And which movie stars do the “gamers” like? There we go, no?

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  6. Pingback: This Week in Reaction (2015/08/09) | The Reactivity Place

  7. Bike Bubba,
    If anyone out there believes that “the girl just kinda falls into the guy’s bed” they are welcome to buy my land in Florida that Groucho Marx sold to me at my cost. Women have agency.
    There does seem to be a deep and visceral fear from women that men will stumble over some “magic formula”. It hasn’t happened yet.

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    • Let’s describe it somewhat differently;sometimes it seems as if the portrayals of romance go “guy is A and does X, Y, and Z, and pretty soon they’re in bed”, and people view that as normal. Seems to me that this will get people to think that it ought to be normative in their lives–and this disarms the warning mechanisms we’re born with.

      Make a bit more sense?

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      • Seduction can be a lot more complicated then simple sexual attraction. So a woman who grew up within a culture that tells her she must sexually empower herself by jumping into bed with someone, that she is a prude if she doesn’t, that this is normal and expected, has been seduced by the world, rather than by some charming man.

        I tend to perceive sexual seduction positively because we all have agency, we can all resist that physical temptation if we want to. Seduction that begins to take on an emotional and psychological edge, like the form of brainwashing that our culture engages in, begins to create questionable agency because we have little resistance and don’t understand what is happening to us.

        Conversely men who are being taught that their sense of self worth and value in the world, indeed their very spirituality, should come from their number of sexual conquests and success with women, are being seduced, not by women, but by those who would profit off of selling such ideas.

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      • I would be very cautious about thoughts like “a culture that tells her” and “men who are being taught”. This for at least three reasons, namely that it 1. (in my eyes) underestimates the degree of own discretion in many or most adults, 2. ignores that much of what is often claimed as imposed by culture or society is actually inborn (cf. the case of Disney and its princesses: little girls do not like princesses because they have been brain-washed by Disney; Disney uses princesses because they know that their movies are more popular among little girl’s this way), 3. what is attributed is often extremely speculative and too easy to fit into a private agenda (I note that I find both your claims dubious). Further note the parallels to pseudo-sciences (at best “proto-“) like gender-studies and the often absurd claims they make based on their outdated belief that a human is just a tabula rasa for society to write on.

        In addition, I strongly suspect that the average person of today is exposed to a wider variety of influences and perspectives than those of “yore”. Without making any statement of which type of sexual moral is the better, I definitely see the “Bible thumping” of a few generations ago as the more brain-washy and less differentiated.

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  8. ” If you don’t like some particular behavior, don’t respond to it and teach your children to spot and avoid it as well.” That sums it up, some people will do things unknowingly or with an objective to manipulate the other. It just needs someone to be wary but not paranoid and suspect everyone is out to use them. The same when it comes to the workplace when people will boost your ego so that you can work harder for the but you won’t get paid any higher for your extra work.

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